Revolutionizing Therapy: Pabel Martinez on Plurawl’s AI-driven Journey

In this episode of Beyond Normal Podcast, join host Kenny Groom as he dives into an enlightening conversation with Pabel Martinez, the visionary founder of Plurawl. Discover how Plurawl is revolutionizing therapy with AI-powered life coaching that identifies and helps overcome limiting beliefs. Pabel shares his personal journey from tech roles at major companies to developing an app that offers accessible mental health support.

Explore the challenges and breakthroughs in creating an AI tool that fosters personal growth and self-awareness. Whether you’re curious about digital therapy solutions or passionate about mental health innovation, this episode provides a compelling look at how technology is transforming therapeutic practices.

Thanks for tuning into the Beyond Normal Podcast!

Don’t forget to like and subscribe to stay updated on all our future episodes from Beyond Normal Media. If you have any questions or comments, feel free to leave them in the comment section below—we love hearing from you! 

Transcript

Kenny: 0:33

Hey, what's going on everybody. My name is Kenny groom. I am your host of the beyond normal podcast. I'm excited to, be recording for season seven. I can't believe we've made it to this point. We've seen some incredible growth. And for those that have been with us this entire time. Thank you. If this is your first time listening, I hope you get some nuggets from what we're about to explore today. we are going to be talking to the founder of Plural, Pabel Martinez. Plural, focuses on AI powered life coaching that helps you identify and overcome your limiting beliefs. for those of us who haven't necessarily, I've experienced the app myself. We'll get into that during the episode. but for those that have not necessarily, been, in therapy, throughout their life, I think this is a really cool tool. first step for, for those of us that are looking for, therapy options out for out there. So without further ado, let's bring a Pabel to the stage. How's it going to Pabel.

Pabel: 1:39

Hey, what's up? What's up? Y'all glad to be here.

Kenny: 1:42

Thank you for being on the platform. I know as a founder, you are really, really busy at all times. There's always fires to put out. and so, you being able to spend a little bit of time with us today to share your story, and let us know more about the platform you're building. we definitely appreciate that. so can you, can you start out, I gave a brief, intro of the product, but maybe you can start out. Let's go back and learn a little bit about your background, your experience. Like, like, what have you been doing with your life prior to, starting this company here?

Pabel: 2:18

Yeah. So before launching this company, I was working like 10 plus years in tech. worked at companies like Facebook for four years and my last role was working at tick tock. So I was a global account director at Tick Tock. And I always say that, yeah, I was a tech employee, but I've always felt like I carried the second job as, as an actor at work, because when I would go into work, I would often be like the only, you know, black or Latino person in a room, in a meeting on a team. And I felt like I had to be someone else. No one necessarily told me that at work, but I felt the pressure to, you know, Act like the best white male version that I could be because that's what I saw everyone else doing so I had a lot of limiting beliefs and self doubt when I was in those spaces about like do I belong here? Am I good enough? am I gonna make it will I ever be promoted? I was overwhelmed with those thoughts.

Kenny: 3:22

I think we all can definitely relate to that. I just had to take a minute to reflect on it. that actually brings me to how I found you, via LinkedIn, because you have some, You mentioned that you were going through those experiences in corporate America, where you felt like you had to like code switch and identify somebody that you're not because your LinkedIn profile now is. is so unique, right? That that's what draws me to you. So it's curious to, I'm curious to hear that you actually went through that experience and that now you're at a point now where just based off your content on LinkedIn, which is how I found you, I feel like you're 100 percent or as close as possible to owning up to your own personal identity. Does that, does that make sense?

Pabel: 4:10

Yeah, and it's so funny that you said that man And I really really appreciate that like that's what That's the energy that I want to put out there. And it's funny because even something like LinkedIn, I would tell myself like, Oh, if I write about this or that, then, people aren't going to take me seriously at work. Or if I make a joke on LinkedIn, then my clients are going to see it and not want to work with me. And I'm doing is just like making up a bunch of stories in my head. Right. I have no proof. It's not like a client ever told me like, yo, if you. Write a personal opinion on LinkedIn or make a joke or try to be funny. Like I'm never going to work with you. Like I just told myself that. Right. And that's the problem is that, like, based on, either our life experiences or the traatic things that our family have been through, like, we're scared to oftentimes take certain steps in life because of what we think is going to happen as if we can predict the future. But it's not true. So, yeah, these days I've still working on myself, but I've let go of a lot of that fear and I try to be myself at all at all times.

Kenny: 5:13

It's interesting that you, you bring that up. most of these social media platforms specifically, they're, they're supposed to be like this blank slate, like where people can make their own identity, right? But for some reason, I don't know why people go to a platform like LinkedIn and then, like they create their business profile and you can create it any way you want. And then we all just end up seeing to your point, like white version of business. Like it is really interesting because I know there's some conspiracy theories and things like that around it, but it's just really interesting how some of these platforms they have like a monotone voice, even though at the same time, they're promoting for people to be their true selves. If that makes sense. Like it's such a, it's such a paradox to me. It really is.

Pabel: 6:13

think, I think LinkedIn is just a small subset of like what the world is or like what the business world

Kenny: 6:21

So,

Pabel: 6:23

LinkedIn, they have guidelines, like you have to code switch on LinkedIn or like you have to talk in a certain way, but the reason that we do that is because we look around. Right. In a digital world, we look around and we see other people talk a certain way. And then we're like, oh, well, if everyone is talking a certain way, that means I have to do it. Right. Even if you look at my content, you're like, Oh, well, he's an outlier, right? Like he may talk a certain way. He acts like himself, but not everyone else is talking like that. So let me, let me just do what everyone else is doing. And that's what we do at work. If we go into work and everyone is talking a certain way, dressing a certain way, we're going to do the same because we want to be accepted by the majority. So that that's just life, bro. Like that, that's just like han nature. We all want to be accepted. Like it's difficult. Like standing out. We've been taught, especially as people of color to not stand out because standing out is a bad thing. don't want to stand out.

Kenny: 7:20

all right, so this whole conversation of standing out and you were in tech for, for quite a bit. I have some experience in tech as well. Like, do you feel like tech, like did it, there's, there's this like preconceived notion, like people that work in tech, like they're able to, like, Kind of bring them their whole selves to work a little bit more than in other environments. Like, what are your, what's your thoughts on that? And then I guess on the back end of that, what made you take the leap of faith to not be in tech anymore, working for somebody else, but then start your own thing.

Pabel: 8:06

Yeah. I mean, so that's why I wanted to work in tech originally. and, and, you know, I'm still in, I'm still in tech, you know, with, with the company I created, it is, it is a tech company, but I wanted to work in tech because Of the values that it communicates. Like there's this idea that you can be yourself. Right. And in fact, it's often in a lot of the values, right. Even when I wanted to work at Meta, you know, Facebook at the time, that was a big thing. It was communicated that like, come as you are, we will accept you. As long as you get your work done, it doesn't really matter. Right. But I think, I don't think they really know, like authenticity Or I don't think people that work there really understand to what level they're comfortable letting people be themselves. like, I mean, this happens at every job that I've had. But I was at meta, I got a lot of resistance for being myself. I was hit with the microaggressions. I was labeled aggressive and unapproachable and unfriendly and all these kind of things. so I think sometimes tech companies say like beer most authentic self, but I think sometimes that means like. you don't have to wear a suit or a button down shirt. Like you can wear a t shirt, but I think authenticity so far beyond just being able to wear a t shirt. So as much as they say it, I don't know if they are ready really accept in a microaggression world, our authenticity,

Kenny: 9:57

Yeah, agree with you. Definitely. It goes past like the tech ethos of like, come, come in your Hawaiian shirts and your shorts and accept it. It's like more, a little bit more than that. Like, to your point, like. You know, like it's how people talk cultures. It's like food, like all these things that pop up it's for, for black and Latino. Right. It would be like hair, like is a big thing for us. Like coming into the work with our hair, the way we want it, like, Hey, it's a really big thing, but for some, like you said, like, like those nuances, they're not really sure, and I appreciate you framing it that way, because they're not even sure how far they're willing to go until somebody comes, to the table and approaches them in a culture that is completely foreign to them.

Pabel: 10:46

I agree and I also think I believe that there's, there, there's one thing of like company. you, I also think there is a responsibility on us to not give a fuck or give less of a fuck. And I know that's kind of scary to hear in times where people are cutting jobs. it's a competitive job market, but I do think that we should to look for places that will accept us for who we are not try to assimilate just because We want to put big tech companies on our reses, you know what I mean? Like, I started doing my best work when I was at Meta when I stopped faking it. And it's a common story among everybody. and not just at Meta, but everybody that I've spoken to have done, you know, in the research that I've done, like, people don't do their best work. they stop faking it because they're spending so much time in that assimilation process.

Kenny: 11:51

It is hard lesson to learn, for sure. You're leveraging those, those lessons learned now. So I'm curious as you created the company, what are those things you're taking away from those experiences that you're using every day now that you're a founder of a tech company?

Pabel: 12:13

Yeah, so what I've learned is that people essentially stop faking it and they start being themselves for two reasons. One of them is see somebody that in some ways almost like gives them permission to be themselves. It's kind of like this idea of like. If you see it, then you believe that you can be it, right? Like if you see somebody that looks like you or share some sort of identity around you and you see them on stage or somewhere on LinkedIn or whatever at work and they're being themselves and they're like killing it at work, you're like, oh, shit, well, if they could do it, then I could do it, right? That's why a lot of my content on LinkedIn is. just giving people their flowers and showing praise. So I just like be like, yo, you don't believe you could be it. Look at this person. They probably look like you and they're killing it and they got the swag to match, right? So that's what all my content does. Now, the other reason that people stop faking it, and which is this one is the unfortunate part is they often have some sort of like mental health breakdown, call it burnout, call it a crisis, whatever it is, but they reach a point of just like exhaustion. And they're just like, Fuck it. I'm tired of faking it. I'm just gonna be myself right and that's why I created the app that I created plural because I think the app will help people avoid that moment of crisis because If you vent to the app or journal about what you're experiencing, you click one button and we'll give you insight into why you're feeling that way. Like, we'll highlight the limiting belief that you're likely holding onto about yourself that is preventing you from taking that next step and being yourself, right? So for me, if I vented during my experience at Facebook, the app would have told me like, yo, P, you're, you're jping to conclusions. Like, how do you know that situation is going to happen in the future without any evidence to back it up? Right. So that's an insight that I learned when I went to therapy, but I was like, how can I create a product that can like mimic that therapy experience at a fraction of the cost and is accessible 24 seven.

Kenny: 14:17

I, I experienced the tool myself. I've given, people knows I've given them some feedback on it. And for me, it was an eye opener as somebody who recently has, you know, started going to therapy. And there's like these moments that you, like, like you mentioned, like these moments, they just pop up and if you don't have a resource there, it could turn into like the end of the world, like quick. But if you have something there that you can use to talk through it, it, it allows you to evaluate and like level set. is probably like the term that comes, comes to mind the, that top of mind for me. And just at first, it's like, why? I'll be honest. Right. And it's like, I'm talking to a robot, like what, but it asks you these, these questions. Of like the, you go through the discovery process and I'm glad like a lot of your materials like focus on self discovery because I could tell like just from the questions that it was asking me, it's not necessarily trying to give you an answer, but it's giving you the space to like think through and level set through, you know, the, the challenge or the, the idea that's in your head in the moment. And so I found a lot of power in that. And as somebody who. found therapy later on in life. I appreciate this app for what it does for me. And it allows me to, on a daily basis, not have to say, I gotta call my therapist right now. Like this is, you know, escalated immediately. Like I can truly, talk through it. But the robot, I'll be honest, it's going to take some, it took me maybe like a day or two, but once I figured that piece out, it was like, Oh, this is, this is cool. It does like the sentiment piece. it does some really cool stuff. like journaling is, it brings like journaling to. Like the 2025 to me, like, I don't know too many people that actively like journal now. And then for those that do it, I don't feel like they share their experience of what it does for them. This is like the modern day, like, this is me getting into journaling a little bit, leveraging this app. So I appreciate you for building this. They have a long story. That was a little ramble there. but they had, that was my tape, man.

Pabel: 17:07

I appreciate that. And you bring up so many points around. Like, listen, I went to therapy and like, I saw her once a week, but like, what about those other six days of the week? Right? if I have a panic attack at two in the morning, I contact my therapist. She's not gonna respond. She's sleeping. She's a han, right? Like, hans just have limitations because we're hans, right? Like, so I don't even think that it will necessarily replace therapists. I think it will complement

Kenny: 17:37

Yeah, exactly.

Pabel: 17:37

already doing. The ideal scenario probably is like this. Plus that

Kenny: 17:44

Mhm. Mhm.

Pabel: 17:47

it may be a replacement and like, that's fine. because not everybody can afford it and access it. But for others, I do think it will compliment. And I think another point that you bring up is, like, we all need an outlet to process our thoughts. And I think about my own, Experience when I was working in tech and I was going through all these things. Like I couldn't talk to my family about it because they didn't understand, like they've never been in the rooms that I've been in. Right. They're going to be like, yo, what are you complaining about? Like, don't you get free breakfast, lunch, and dinner? Like, know, I can't talk to my friends because they, they got jobs, but it's also not the specific things that I'm going through. So at some point you're just like, all right, who the fuck do I talk to? And what people have said is that they feel safer. Talking to this quote unquote robot because they don't feel like the robot is going to come with these like preconceived notions or bias around it and they can feel like free kind of like talking to it. and the other thing lastly is that, we built it intentionally to not tell you what to do. Like, if you say you want to, like, break up with your girlfriend, we're not gonna be like, oh, yeah, go for it. We're gonna be like, well, why do you want to do that? How do you feel when you're around her? Like, we want to help you make your own decision just through these qualifying questions.

Kenny: 19:09

That that spurred just spurred the thought for me. Like you said, finding a therapist is almost like, in the black community is almost like finding a church or like finding a friend group, like finding a therapist isn't like, Oh, you just go to an app and you're just picking. You know, you pick your first therapist and then that's your therapist moving forward. A lot of times you have to go through the process of, you may want a therapist that's of a specific, religious faith. practice, you know, therapy style, you know, the things like that. So to your point, like it's, this is probably a compliment to the, the in person because the in person can take a lot longer to find that right therapist that's for you versus this. There's no real like bias, right? You can go into it, have your conversations and. be able to go through that self discovery on your own. So there's more onus on you completely versus I feel like the therapist process, at least for the black community, where a lot of people aren't necessarily going to therapy now, probably like less than, less than 20 percent of the people that I know in my entire community. network that I know that are black have gone to therapy, right? And so that's a small nber, but for those that are trying to get into it, it can be a daunting task going through the process of just filtering through those individuals. And so that's where I see the app, like plural, like you said, if you need to have those conversations throughout your week, you have moments where you need to reflect like this app is, is a game changer.

Pabel: 20:51

I appreciate that, man. Thank you. Thank you.

Kenny: 20:54

So tell me a little bit how it is, you, you've got a team, right? so you're not, you're a solo founder in terms of the one who's. Who's creating it. Right. But you've got a team to support this. You're leveraging AI. I talk a little bit about how you've built out your team to, to, to make the magic happen in the plural app.

Pabel: 21:14

Yeah, so I'm a non technical solo founder, so I'm not doing any of the coding. Yeah, I'm not doing any of the building, but I had the vision. I had the idea and I did the research. I had the conversations. I did the focus groups around like yo, what kind of apps are you using you know, do this do that? What do you want? And, just to like validate my idea. So I had an idea going into it. and then I just spoke to like a bunch of friends and people in my network who journaled, who went to therapy, who never did any of the two and try to figure out why. And then. essentially cashed out my 401k to build this. So I paid and still paying an app development team to build and take it from like idea to product maintain it and make a bunch of updates. So I'm still working with them now. the first people that we gave access to the actual app, once we did launch is our group of clinical advisors. So I. Within my network, I know a bunch of folks, talented, very smart individuals with a different skill set than me and experience around like they are licensed. therapist, right? So they're already working with clients and they have insight around, like, is this how the app should be responding? Is this a safe, resource to direct people if they say that they want to do self harm or all these other things, right? Like, they're really providing the, around, like, what that client patient therapist relationship is like, so that we can do our best to mimic, The sort of insights that they're giving their clients and make sure that the platform is safe so that once we do scale it to more people, I'm not worried if somebody is, you know, experiencing a crisis situation. So that's kind of like a little bit about the team that I'm working with, but I'm the only like full time person on plural so far. Yeah.

Kenny: 23:17

around a non technical. you know, there, there, there's folks out there that are trying to build applications, you know, software based tools. And so it's really cool that you're going about, building out your team the right way and acknowledging early on, raising your hand, like, Hey, I'm not a coder. I need somebody to really get in here and do this. Like, I appreciate that perspective.

Pabel: 23:41

And I could have tried to learn code. There's a lot of people that try to learn it. There's a bunch of like AI tools that you can go out there and build it too. But, I wanted to move fast and, I know I have like a very specific set of skill sets based on my experience, so I just wanted to focus on that and just like, fuck it. I'm like, you know, fuck it. I'm gonna take a risk. I can build up my 401k again, but I just want to like work with a team that is already been there done that I can build it faster than I can. so it's not the only way to do it. It's just the way that I did it so far

Kenny: 24:15

So tell me, so you just said you cashed out the 401k. I think we've talked about this before. my wife would, she would like over there. I think it's what I said when we talked about it. But I, I think that,

Pabel: 24:34

you even for the thought of thinking about it.

Kenny: 24:36

that there's like, it would be, it would not be good. but that is really going all in and believing in yourself. They were like, I'm not sure that many people have the gption, right. If I can use that word to actually. Do that. And so I'm curious, like with you, with you taking that step and cashing out your 401k, like, what would it look like? Do you need, do you need, like, do you need to go down the path of like getting investors and like doing seed rounds and things like that? Do you, do you see or foresee yourself doing that in the future? Or do you feel like you want to self fund this fully? yourself.

Pabel: 25:19

Yeah I mean always told myself like yo worst case scenario if this doesn't work out I'll just go back to what I was doing and like I was I was making pretty good money when I was working before. So like, in some ways I'm not necessarily worried about getting a job. So yeah, it was a big risk. Listen, I invested, I cashed out a lot of money in my 401k. Like I, like if you go on my 401k account is literally zero. I'm not saying I cashed out something like all of that shit is gone. So yeah, it

Kenny: 25:48

it.

Pabel: 25:50

the way that I look at it, like, I really feel like what I'm building is like, Knowing the lotto nbers that are going to come out tomorrow, like you have the ability to like cash out that ticket, but like, all you got to do is like bet on yourself and buy the ticket. You know what I mean? Like, I just believe in it. I know it's not a matter of like, if it's going to be successful, it's a matter of like, when and how big, you know what I mean? So, Yeah, I mean, in theory, I could continue to self fund, I'm also operating in a space where there's a lot of big players that are competition, you know, listen, apple not too long ago, released a journal app that is native. So, like, anytime you buy an iphone, that shit is just automatically in there, right? headspace has been in the game for a while. There's a bunch of different big companies that are launching similar. Sort of absent services. So I need to move quickly and funding will help me do that. So, I want to raise venture capital, money. I want to raise money from angels so that we can move faster. because if I think if we don't, when people think about these types of services, they may not think about us. And lastly, the reason why I think that's important is because. I think I'm the only company that is building this sort of service and technology that is thinking about in prioritizing black and Latino communities. So whoever is nber one, whoever people think about when they think about these sort of apps and services, I would like them to be someone that is thinking about these communities. I don't want us to be an afterthought. I want us to be the priority. So that's why I think moving really quickly is really important as well.

Kenny: 27:58

I appreciate that. perspective and the way that you're building it with the intentionality of serving black and Latino communities. Like you said, there isn't someone who's doing that, even at the scale of like an apple, or the Android, you know, their native applications are typically built for the masses. Right. And so their main, their net, there's not necessarily going to be, specific applications in most cases within those native. communities that are particular to black and Latino, communities, right? And so that, that's a, that's a differentiator, but in itself, and we know we need that more, more than ever now in terms of platforms that are the FUBU model for us by us. And so I'm looking forward to you raising and scaling appropriately, man.

Pabel: 28:51

Thank you. And I just want to be clear too. Like, I'm not saying, for example, like we're, we're going to be running pilot programs and test at different colleges, universities, as well as corporations and like going into these, these, these, like I'm making it very clear. Like this is for everybody. The app is for everybody. Like anybody can use it. There's a bunch of white people that use the app. What I believe when building a product is that if you build a product for the most underserved and vulnerable, then it will by default be accessible for everybody. You know what I mean? It's like, if you create a video on Instagram or TikTok that, that, even did someone that is deaf can take it, can understand what's going on, but with that content with text overlays, with, with, headlines, with all these sorts of things, then by default, it's, it's a better experience for everybody. You know what I mean?

Kenny: 29:49

I like that example too. I think certain communities go over, they're, they're overlooked at times. And it's just like, well, you can just build it with this framework. You build it for them. And then everybody else's use cases included in that by default, that just seems like a logical way to build something. but that is not always the case. So I, I, I definitely see the need. So outside of you building this app, I'm curious, like what apps, like what's it, what's in your top apps right now? Like what's the top app that you're using outside of plural

Pabel: 30:24

Oh, easy hinge.

Kenny: 30:27

hinge. I love it. I love it. Oh,

Pabel: 30:32

even played that shit is nber one.

Kenny: 30:35

Oh my gosh. And what is the reason for our listeners? what, what do you use and hinge for? Are you trying to find the one? I

Pabel: 30:46

I would love to find the one. Yeah. I mean, Yeah, your boy, your boy single, your boy lonely. think hinge me, at least I've seen the best women on hinge. I've had the most, the most connections that have led to conversations and dates have come from hinge, compared to like, you know, Tinder or Bble or some of the other dating apps. So yeah, your boy looking for bae.

Kenny: 31:19

love it. I'm not mad at it. You know, my situation, I'm curious though, like what, for you, for you being in founder mode right now, like what does finding that person, like, what would that do for you?

Pabel: 31:34

Oh, I think finding that person would help my mental health. so one of the things talk about love languages, right? One of my love languages is physical touch. one of the reasons why I love my grandma. And I visit her very often, like every week or every other week is because she lets me hug and squeeze her. She lets me show her affection she's also affectionate. Like she'll rub your arm or whatever. Like my mom is like, Oh my God, that's too tight. Get away from me. Right? Like, she's funny like that. like when I hug my grandma, all my problems go away.

Kenny: 32:27

Mm hmm.

Pabel: 32:29

It just, it just, I can't even describe it. It's just like, It is like that, right? For some people, it's words of affirmation. For some people, it's this and that. But, I think having a partner where you're able to show, express, receive love, on a consistent basis, like, oh man, that, that, that's amazing for your mental health.

Kenny: 32:52

Yeah, for sure.

Pabel: 32:54

Besides the other things, you know what I mean? You know what I mean?

Kenny: 33:00

That was a great answer. Oh my gosh. But you are right. I think, I mean, it is, it is like stability in terms of like having that person you can go to and they know how to like calm you down and things like that. Like that, that is really like, that's undervalued. And life in general, but then the hecticness of like starting something new, all the uncertainty you're hearing, no, all the time from people either using your app and saying no, or investors and things like that. Like you need some ways to. To decompress or just like level set, right? As all of this is happening. And so having a, having a significant other is definitely a cheat code to me. I don't think we've, we've explored it enough on the platform and I'm actually trying to figure out how we can explore that more. So I appreciate you being candid and honest about the apps you're using and what you're trying to get right now in this moment. While being here, right? Like while, while doing all the, all the other cool, amazing stuff that people think, like there's value in having that, that other person.

Pabel: 34:10

Oh, for sure. I mean, for me, I just think about it like, yeah, I'm looking for my best friend. I mean, obviously, you know, love her, love my life, all that stuff, but like, I think when it's best described, like, yeah, I'm looking for my best friend. Who doesn't who doesn't want to find their best friend?

Kenny: 34:27

You got me thinking after this, I'm about to go spend time with my best friend. But, so, how can I, I've, I've done my testimony about the app. You explain a little bit about the focus of the app. Like how can folks right now tap in, to plural sign up, like, like walk us through the easiest way for people to start, getting in the app and, and, and having that self discovery

Pabel: 34:57

Yeah, so it's free to download, and every Person that download like automatically you get a free 14 day trial So you don't have to put in any credit card information It's very simple. You just create an account with like name email. I'm, sorry, email password You And then you can just start your self discovery process. And once you're in the app, it's, it's very simple. You just vent, talk about whatever you're experiencing, whatever's going on. You click one button and we'll highlight whatever limiting beliefs you seem to be holding onto, whether you're experiencing self doubt or jp into conclusions. then you can have a conversation one on one with the AI, if that's easier for you. so yeah, it's really simple. We just want to help you learn about yourself

Kenny: 35:42

I downloaded from the Apple app store. It's an Apple and Android.

Pabel: 35:49

uh, so Android will have it later this year.

Kenny: 35:52

Okay.

Pabel: 35:52

but right now it's only available for apple. So if you go to our website, plural. com, P L U R A W L. there are two links where there's one link where you can sign up for the Android wait list so that you can be the first one to sign up. Be updated. We'll send an email out when it when it's live there's a link where you can just download it from the app store, but it's available for for apple phones right now.

Kenny: 36:14

All right. That's dope. what else trying to think? Well, you can go ahead and, I'll, I'll pass it to you. I appreciate you coming on the platform. And sharing, your learnings, from going through and being a founder, taking your experience in tech all that time. and now you're at a point now where you're building this really cool company. I've been hands on with the product myself. so I see the first, I've seen firsthand the value in it. And then as somebody who's on my, therapy journey. I definitely see this being an app that many, many people, get value from, but, I want to pass it to you last thing, kind of close out thoughts. You want to leave us on as we, as we look to wrap this up.

Pabel: 37:08

Yeah, I appreciate that. So listen, therapy, mental health, all these sort of buzzwords. They're really intimidating and they're scary. In fact, they probably scare most people from ever going into it. So I would think of plural as a thought partner, right? And here's why you got to think about it like that. According to the National Science Foundation, 95 percent of people's thoughts Are repetitive and 80 percent of those repetitive thoughts that I'm talking about are negative So on a daily basis, we're stuck on this endless loop and replay of self doubt. So You need a resource Keep you in check and let you know like yo, may be jping to conclusions may be just creating your story and may be creating a story in your head around you think may happen, but it may not be true. We'll help you Identify why you're feeling like that and put you on the right track so that you can start being your best self

Kenny: 38:04

I love that, man. That's a great way to close this out. folks, make sure that you chat, you tap in, via the, the website and the app. And, without further ado, I just want to say, thank you for tuning in, to another great episode of the beyond normal podcast. Peace.

Pabel: 38:26

That was dope, man